Is veganism a bit extreme?!


Question: Is veganism a bit extreme!?
I mean, the animal kingdom is full of symbiotic relationships!.!.!.animals benefiting from one another, so is it really so horrible that we have pets, use wool, butter, etc as long as the animals are treated well!?

I can understand not KILLING another animal to eat it, I couldn't eat meat if I had to kill my own and I'm a big hypocrite because I do eat meat!. I know that about myself!. I get the free range thing!. I get the small organic farm thing where the animal is loved and appreciated, and raised in a healthy natural environment!. I think the cost of meats and animal products should be a lot higher than it is so that animals can live in humane conditions!. I really do!.

But remember that while these animals certainly have the ability to suffer and do not deserve suffering at the hands of humans, they were bred for their benefit to us, and if they weren't raised for that purpose, they wouldn't exist at all!. There aren't any more wild chickens!.

I'm asking to get another point of view, not to start any controversy!.Www@FoodAQ@Com


Answers:
Here's the thing, though!. I don't think breeding a living, breathing, thinking, feeling creature for the sole purpose of dying for my tastebuds is ethically acceptable!. That's not a symbiotic relationship, it's slavery!. And to me, THAT is what is extreme!. Just because we've manipulated certain species into relying on us to keep them alive, it doesn't justify breeding them in enormous numbers and then NOT keeping them alive!. We kill 10 billion land animals for food every year in the U!.S!. alone!. Animals are a commodity, not a life to be cared for!. If your proposal to raise them all organically, under humane conditions, we wouldn't be able to supply 10% of what the industry is supplying now and you're right, prices would skyrocket!. In some ways that would be better because fewer animals would suffer, but even a cow who was raised on fluffy pink clouds, pixie dust and rainbows still has to be murdered when it comes time to feed the masses!. If ANY of it was necessary for human nutrition, I could wrap my head around that!. But it's not!. I can thrive on a plan-based diet, so I do!. I can sleep at night because I am not contributing to the suffering of sentient beings!.

As for animal byproducts like dairy and eggs, those animals are not treated well!. It's the same as the slaughter industry: volume hurts animals!. Dairy cows must be forcibly artificially inseminated repeatedly to keep them pregnant and producing!. Male calves are slaughted for veal and females follow their mothers into a life of steroids, antibiotics, growth hormones, mechanical milking, rape racks, chronic mastitis!.!.!. and slaughter when their poor, worn out bodies can no longer support a pregnancy, something that happens at 4 or 5 years, not the 15 or 20 that she should have lived had her needs and her nature been taken into account!. Eggs from treasured hens kept as companion animals may be just fine, but that's simply not the reality for most people!. Commercial egg production murders 280 million males chicks annually, as soon as they are sexed!. That's damn near a dead baby for every man, woman and child in the U!.S!. Do you think if everyone had to kill their own innocent, fluffy little yellow chick in order to get a carton of eggs that more people would figure out that you can live happily and healthfully without them!? Again, there's nothing, NOTHING symbiotic about any of this!. These animals are not benefitting from battery cages, forced moulting and a future as dog food!.

As for pets, most vegans recognize a world of difference between an animal living as a member of the family (which IS symbiotic) and animals bred for death!. I know a LOT of vegans and I'd estimate that upwards of 90% of us share our lives with animals whose welfare we take complete responsibility for in exchange not for milk or egg or meat, but for a little love and affection!. There are extremists in the vegan community who think dogs and cats, who have shared our lives for millenia, should be bred out of existence, but most of us are nowhere near there!.Www@FoodAQ@Com

My reason hopefully not aiding in your questiion of being extreme is "why eat second hand what the animal ate!?"!. Eat the produce of the land first hand instead of via the animal!.

I believe the extreme goes when some people become phobic if they find out a certain company does this and that with animals!. The leather and clothes and animal by-products!. I mean the animal could not live forever!.

Www@FoodAQ@Com

I guess to a lot of people who eat all these things vegans dont would think it was extreme!. But in my opinion its great, even if you can limit your intake of eggs and milk and such!. My family eats meat but since Im a vegan they limit a lot of stuff and settle for soup or pasta a few nights!. They dont complain since my vegan recipes are amazing =]Www@FoodAQ@Com

Yeah for sure it is!. The diet started for religious reasons, nothing to do with animal welfare!. Animal products were avoided because animals were seen as unclean so anything that came from them was likewise tainted!. Most modern vegans don't ascribe to this belief, it must be said, and follow the diet for other reasons but that is where it originated!.

On a sideline note, I should point out that there are in fact wild chickens!. They're called jungle fowl and they live in the forests of South East Asia!. All domestic animals are offshoots of wild species that were successful in the wild and which still exist in some places (and would still exist in more were it not for habitat destruction by humans)!. Www@FoodAQ@Com

I don't feel that it's extreme at all!. I eat what grows naturally!.
Meat eaters eat what has been imprisoned, fed pesticides and injected full of antibiotics and hormones!.

Since cows have to get pregnant to give milk, and if the resulting calf is male it is sold for veal- dairy consumers purchase a product which supports the veal industry!. Veal calves are kept in tiny crates without adequate room to turn around or lie down!. Taken at birth from their mothers, they are fed a chemical cocktail which keeps them anemic so the meat will stay white!. It also keeps them in a painful state of gastric distress and constant diarrhea!. They are allowed no exercise, to keep the meat tender!. The best thing that happens to them is an early death!. That seems "extreme" to me!.

Egg producing operations sex chicks when they are a few days old!. They have no use for the males, and they are either tossed into garbage bags and left to suffocate, or they are thrown in to a grinder!. Again, that seems "extreme!."

Whether or not they were bred for the use of humans, some things are just wrong!. I choose not to support such an industry!.Www@FoodAQ@Com

I'm vegan, and I can say that veganism is extreme!.
The only reason I am vegan and not vegetarian, is because of the cruel conditions of dairy and egg farms!. It's my own personal protest!. I just don't feel comfortable being a part of a cruel system!.
And I completely don't agree with you when you say that because they were "bred for their benefit to us" that doesn't mean that we have to use them!. It won't bother me at all if they become extinct because we decided not to "breed them for our benefit!." In fact, I would be so relieved to know that these animals will be forever removed from that kind of suffering!. Www@FoodAQ@Com

veganism is awesome

=]

i am a vegetarian and any vegan out there is my roll model!. they have to give up a lot of "tasty" food to be one!. they are completely cruelty free so i say good, no!. GREAT for them!. and i do mean it!.

i am waiting for the day when my parents allow me to become vegan because i know that you cannot eat dairy without the calf sold to slaughter for veal and you cannot eat eggs without the hen going to slaughter and supporting the male chicks being killed at hatching!.

i cannot wait until they let me go vegan because i will have a great weight lifted off my shouldersWww@FoodAQ@Com

First of all, there are many reasons to be a vegan!. I'm doing it for my health, which has nothing to do with symbiotic relationships!.

On your point:
"But remember that while these animals certainly have the ability to suffer and do not deserve suffering at the hands of humans, they were bred for their benefit to us, and if they weren't raised for that purpose, they wouldn't exist at all!. There aren't any more wild chickens!."

I'm sure that most vegans would say that they would rather these animals have never existed in the first place than suffer through everything that they do merely for human benefit!. Just because they are fed does not mean the relationship is "symbiotic!."

A symbiotic relationship implies choice on the the part of both species!.!.!.if you removed the fences, buildings, and cages from a chicken farm do you really think the chickens would hang around!? Of course not!. The relationship between animals and factory farms is hardly symbiotic!.

You're right that not ALL farms are abusive to the animals they house, but most are!. Do I think it's wrong for someone to raise their own chicken in well kept conditions and eat its eggs!? Nope!. Do I think it's wrong for a company to raise thousands of chickens and raise them in cramped, unsanitary, abusive conditions so that they can make a faster buck!? Absolutely!.

Just a note as well: Just because it says "Free Range" or "Organic" does not mean that the animal was treated well!. Organic does not refer to the conditions the animals are raised in, and "free range" is not regulated by the government (not that I trust government regulation anyway!.)!.

I agree with you wholeheartedly on one thing:
"I think the cost of meats and animal products should be a lot higher than it is so that animals can live in humane conditions!. I really do!."
Wouldn't THAT be nice!.!.!.!.!.meat tax and dairy tax, anyone!?!
I think the vegans (and possibly vegetarians) would be the only ones jumping for joy if that were imposed, but hey, who am I to argue!?Www@FoodAQ@Com

Hi, I really appreciate the honest and candid nature of your question and the responses it has generated!.

My point of view is this: it's great that you are at least aware of what's going on!. That's more than I can say for most people!. You said that you do think it's important for the animals to be treated well and that you would advocate paying more if that could be the case!.

Well, I must echo the sentiment on here that free-range is not well-regulated!. It doesn't necessarily meet everyone's conception of "cruelty-free!." Perhaps the only way to be that way is to cut out the animal products entirely!. But you should do what you can!. You know, one thing I have heard a lot before is that you should learn what you can about where your food comes from and how the animals are treated!. It may be that you can support farms that treat their animals somewhat better than most!. I'd say it's a start!. It's much better than just feeling guilty and buying yet another mcdonald's hamburger!.

Do what you can!. You know, you can even eat less meat, dairy, and eggs!.!.!.Experiment with vegetarian cooking!. It's not bad! And vegan cooking, too!. You know, a lot of times it even tastes better!. So there are many options for you, even if you feel you cannot commit to being a vegan or a vegetarianism!. The point is awareness and conscientiousness!.

I also think that if more people cared about the well-being of animals, the conditions would improve!. I also think that the cost would go down if people did pay more for better conditions!. It wouldn't cost as much if everyone bought it!. I think that way about organic foods as well!.!.!.Www@FoodAQ@Com

Nature intended us to eat animals!. you see a lot of animals in the animal kingdom eat each other, its nature!. our bodies need iron and an other vitamins to survive!. some of the vitamins can be found in other products but nothing compares to meat!. I think vegan-ism is very extreme!. Most people develop problems later in life from cutting out dairy and meat from there diets!. But we have to respect those people for their choice!. No one can judge how a person should live there life!. If your not comfortable with eating meat then don't!. But male sure that you have all the facts before you decide and make sure its for the right reasons!. also have a chat with a nutritionist and i am sure they have other supplements that can almost match meat!.

It does seem inhumane to breed animals for a specific use!. But humans have out grown there means to survive without this method!.

hope this gives you another prospectiveWww@FoodAQ@Com

What you might not understand is what those Animals go through!. They suffer greatly, even if it is just to give milk!. The mother has her calf's taken away and sold for Veal!. Where they stand in a tiny box for their entire life!. Leather comes from Animals that were cruelly killed!. Fur comes from Animals that are skinned alive!. Your thinking about Animal products as a product!. Your not understanding how those products come to be!.

Everyone should hope for the ending of suffering in this world!. Vegans just do more then hope, they DO SOMETHING ABOUT IT!Www@FoodAQ@Com

i can;t define extreme, but I'll say I find it silly!. Life will not be on earth forever!. Someday ALL life here will be gone!. Will it really matter at that point whether some died to make coats and some died in "nature"!?Www@FoodAQ@Com





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