Veg*n - atheist?!
Veg*n - atheist?
if it wasn't for becoming a full blown atheist a few years ago i don't think i would ever have been able to open my mind up to veganisim.
in reading into the creationist/evolution debate i also learned alot about how the world works and how everything came about... This set some solid foundations for me realising that the exploitation of animals who are seemingly not as evolved as us, can't be justified.
"in a world older and more complete than ours, they move finished, and complete."
I was wondering how other peoples religiouse beleifs influence them on the subject of veg*nisim... Additional Details
1 day ago
again i'd just like to make it clear i'm not suggesting a connection between the two, clearly i think there's a conection for me, one certainly led into the other. But i'm aware this really isn't the case for alot of people. I'm simply interested in how people cordinate one set of values with the other. And you may not even think them seperate values, but you know what i mean...
As i'm prodiminatly interested in the veg*ns views i feel this is the best forum to post the question in, i'm unaware as to how many veg*ns frequent the religion forum, i expect it's less... If there was a V&V forum under a different heading i'd post it there.
21 hours ago
beletje - i said "seemingly" not as evolved... my later quote should obviously testify that i am aware of what you say. I merely point out it is a common asumption that because we're so inteligent, we are more evolved and there for sit on top of the food chain... i don't believe this, but others do.
Answers: 1 day ago
again i'd just like to make it clear i'm not suggesting a connection between the two, clearly i think there's a conection for me, one certainly led into the other. But i'm aware this really isn't the case for alot of people. I'm simply interested in how people cordinate one set of values with the other. And you may not even think them seperate values, but you know what i mean...
As i'm prodiminatly interested in the veg*ns views i feel this is the best forum to post the question in, i'm unaware as to how many veg*ns frequent the religion forum, i expect it's less... If there was a V&V forum under a different heading i'd post it there.21 hours ago
beletje - i said "seemingly" not as evolved... my later quote should obviously testify that i am aware of what you say. I merely point out it is a common asumption that because we're so inteligent, we are more evolved and there for sit on top of the food chain... i don't believe this, but others do. I think when one recognizes religion for what it is: a ludacris idea that promotes war, violence, suffering, and blind denial of anything which can be clearly observed, one will inevitably begin to question the "morality" of our world when it comes to other aspects, such as mankind's exploitation of animals.
I'm a vegan atheist. I think when a person is intelligent enough to question the mainstream on one subject, this person will continue to question. My beliefs influenced me , because I believe animals have a concious and a soul too. Also because I'm clairvoyant If an animal dies I see its soul rise out, and I just can't eat that-But I'm only a vegetarian, Vegan is an expensive lifestyle I can't afford to buy alternatives to everything yet.
That being said,
beliefs, faith, and spirituality does not mean I have a religion. I do not. To me, the 2 are completely unrelated. I have reverence for life and this is a spiritual idea for me. I am religious but not Christian and I don't see why religion must automatically rule out science for some people. I definitely "question the mainstream" and my religion requires that I do so. My religion is against war. Some folks here on Yahoo have black and white ideas on religion: either you are a Christian fundamentalist or atheist and there is nothing in between.
This really belongs in the R&S category so I am moving on. I'm a vegan and an atheist and for me the two are not related in any way.
I became a vegetarian at 16, an atheist in my early twenties and a vegan in my forties. I know a few vegetarian believers and many, many meat-eating atheists.
There may be a connection for some people I guess, but I don't see the logic. im agnostic.. religion really never had an effect on any aspect of my life because i've never followed it, even when i was 'catholic'. i think its great that you've open your eyes to veganism :) isn't it funny how one way of life can contribute to how we inturpret other ways of living? Islam Judaism and Christianity say its ok to eat meat, that god put creatures on this earth for us to eat, and so its ok.
Most Seventh Day Adventist (a Christian denomination) are Vegans.
Veganism is a Lifestyle choice, I see your point cos when a person who uses no animal products tries to persuade an omnivore to eat less or no animal products, they will use the sanctioning of god to indulge in some good old fashioned dead flesh and animal juices hmmm, yum yum lovin it. Judaism, Christianity and Islam are neither for or against eating meat. There are proscriptions/dietary laws, but that no way can be construed to endorsed eating meat.
That religion or spiritual practices can influence becoming veggie heads is another issue, depending on how you interpret your faith or dictates of your spiritual path. I'm an atheist, so no religiouse reasons to my being vegan. I also thought that people who believe in God (any God) should show a little more respect for what they believe to be his creation, though.
Go vegan! I've had problems with religion my whole life... I've read the books of all major religions wishing there would be one that made sense because religion can be a comfort to people. They only made me angry though and, while I'm still interested in religion, I hate it at the same time. I've had the same kind of relationship with the idea of god... I studied theology and, although I tried, I couldn't bring myself to believe in god. I'm not saying it doesn't exist... I just think it's impossible for the human intellect to determine god's existence or god's nature for that matter which most religions claim to do.
Saying that, something which has influenced my life a lot is buddhism. I see it more of a way of life than a religion though because the main sects, like theravada buddhism, aren't based on the existence of any god. I wouldn't call myself a buddhist because there are still some things like reincarnation that I have problems with. It was while studying buddhism that I became a vegan though. I learned a lot about pleasure, pain, suffering and happiness and it made me more compassionate and taught me a lot about life. I reasoned that humans gain pleasure from something else's pain which ultimately leads to suffering and unhappiness.
I didn't realize this until reading my travel journal a few months ago but the day I gave up meat just so happened to be the day I visited over 5 buddhist shrines in Thailand, one of which held the 'lucky buddha'... it's believed that it will bring you happiness if you worship at it. I've visited hundreds of religious temples in the past but have never worshipped at one except for this one for some reason, where I lit some incense and asked buddha for happiness. Well it turns out I gave up meat that day without making a conscious decision of it... I just stopped eating it and I've been a lot happier since doing so. I'm not saying buddha did this for me (because I don't know) but I did find something inside myself that day that's making me a happier person. I'm making more of an effort to alleviate the suffering of both humans and animals when I can and I think buddhism's played a large part in teaching me this. Christians must bear in mind that the only passage which clearly allows animals to be eaten is actually part of a retelling of another story. Noah's Ark is a retelling of the Epic of Gilgamesh, and over 1,000 years late. This is accepted as fact by bible scholars.
Genesis gives man dominion over animals, but is unclear what is meant by dominion. Lords don't usually eat their subjects, though. :P Plenty of passages mention how animals are to be used for ritual sacrifice for sins, but eating those animals would be a blasphemous offense punishable by death. Many other passages mention warnings about eating this animal or that animal, and not only in regards to kosher.
One passage in Isiah mentions "he who killeth an ox is as he who killeth a man". This is a vague passage and some could argue it refers to sacrifice, but sacrifices aren't previously referred to as "killings".
In short: do your research if you really think that Judeo-Christian scripture allows animals to be eaten. I am actually a vegetarian who believes a vegan diet is the best, I just haven't quit eating dairy products entirely..I'm working on it...
Now don't take any of the following as arguing or preaching.. just describing my views on the mater, as you asked for them:
I also am definitely a christian and find no conflict between the two.. After all, according to the bible, the original diet GOd gave to man was vegan.. I don't believe people who say that "God wants us to eat meat" or "That's what God created animals for" Because if you look in the bible, it is clearly not the case.. He GAVE PERMISSION for man to eat meat at the time of the flood.. for obvious reasons.. and Jesus served meat to others (it can be assumed he ate it too, but the only DEFINITE description we have is him serving it to others) but it must be noted that the pollution levels were nonexistent compared to today, and the way animals were raised for food was quite different.. It was safe to eat meat, and not nearly as inhumane.. Anyway anyway... In the Bible.. God does tell us our body is a temple, and we should take care of it.. with everything going on in the meat and animal industry today, it is pretty much unsafe to consume these products, they are so riddled with disease and chemicals.. etc..etc.. So in a way.. I feel that he does require me to take the best care of my body that I can.. and for ME that means leaving alone meat and other unhealthy animal products.. Not always easy and I'm not perfect.. but that is my goal (To eliminate the use of animal products from my diet). Also I think when God put Adam and Eve over the animals, that dominance came with a responsibility to treat them well.. So that, combined with a lifelong deep love of all animals, make modern meat industry practices abhorrent to every part of me..
so you asked how my religious views influenced me on the subject of veganism.. That was the answer.. i agree with you and elizabeth. I think most religions on the whole provide a good moral code to abide by. I myself tend to abide by a Buddhist philosophy, which was actually me reason for becoming vegan - although Buddhists all find their own path and are by no means all vegetarian! I believe I should try to do things for the greater good, even if it causes me a little extra work in the proccess. Buddhist philosophy teaches that you must try to be aware of everything you are doing/using. Don't just blindly load up your shopping basket because advertising told you to buy all that stuff, you have to find out what it really is. When I did this I couldn't carry on with my old lifestyle. Some Buddhists can reconcile with their life styles, but I couldn't. I had to change. Well, I believe in G-d. This is the number one reason I became a vegetarian, because my religion says that animals should not be treated cruelly. If you do eat meat, there is a specific guideline to how the animal should be treated, and how it should be killed. For example: do not kill the mother and child in the same day, do not bathe a calf in her mother's milk. The problem is, I wasn't farming these animals myself, and I wasn't killing them myself so I'm not able to vouche for their treatment.
There is actually evidence that Jesus was a vegetarian. When Jesus fed the 5,000 with a couple loaves of bread and two "fish" the original word was a greek word which more accurately translates to a type of seaweed. I'm a vegan and an agnostic. I really don't see any relationship between the two. There are liberal veg*ans and conservative veg*ans. There are Christian veg*ans (and even an organization for them), Jewish veg*ans, Muslim veg*ans, etc.
My lack of religious beliefs doesn't influence my veganism one way or the other. "This set some solid foundations for me realising that the exploitation of animals who are seemingly not as evolved as us."
I just need to point this out: THEY ARE AS EVOLVED AS US. This means they are evolved to best adapt to their climate and location as we humans are to ours. If this weren't the case they'd be extinct.There's no such thing as more or less evolved.